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ballerinamom13

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Reply with quote  #26 
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Originally Posted by 2dornot2d


From what I heard, they are not the same school/business... and people said they are the "good Joffrey".



I don't know about "good" Joffrey, but they are definitely much more selective and kids who get accepted there have a chance to be considered for the year round program and trainee/second company positions.  If your child has talent and you are spending money to send them to a program, why would you not want the one with the better qualifications and opportunities?  I have zero experience with Joffrey NY because it doesn't have the opportunities other programs have and dd had no interest in attending,  but I think it depends on your kid's goals.  I'm sure it's a decent program and it's in NYC, which is a big plus.  So I think "good" may be a relative term.

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heidi459

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Reply with quote  #27 

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I don't know about "good" Joffrey, but they are definitely much more selective and kids who get accepted there have a chance to be considered for the year round program and trainee/second company positions.  If your child has talent and you are spending money to send them to a program, why would you not want the one with the better qualifications and opportunities?  I have zero experience with Joffrey NY because it doesn't have the opportunities other programs have and dd had no interest in attending,  but I think it depends on your kid's goals.  I'm sure it's a decent program and it's in NYC, which is a big plus.  So I think "good" may be a relative term.



Just expounding....I would agree that the choice between a Joffrey nyc and a Joffrey Chicago's year round program should be a no brainer if it works for a dancer and their family, but for most that's probably not the choice they are faced with.  Maybe it's matter of finances, maybe it's the logistics, maybe they don't get accepted to the school with the big reputation.  So the question for many then seems to become, "is it even worth it if I can't go to one of the more 'coveted' choices?"  Unfortunately, my experience has shown me that for too many the answer to that seems to be no.  

For whatever it's worth, my biggest concern for my own dd is the quality of her training not the name of the school. Lately I've been inundated w/the opinions of well meaning folks... folks who want to insist that dd must switch, NOW, to a company affiliated school.  And for the very same reasons given above... the opportunity for a position down the road. But reality is that only a very small percentage of dancers who attend these company affiliated schools ultimately end up w/a position in these companies.  So does it really make sense to completely uproot her... take her away from a school where we know for a fact that she will be getting top notch training in a very intimate setting... for such a very small chance?  Personally, I don't think so.  Definitely not now.  Maybe never.  

Sorry if I've gone too far afield.  I'm in the midst of the company affiliated schools vs non company affiliated schools discussions with a few people now so it's a topic that hits home.                    

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meatball77

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Reply with quote  #28 
I think too many people pick programs based on their names as opposed to which program really offers what their kids need.  You need to look at what your child needs in a program based on what they get at home and what they need for the future.  Do they need more performance experience?  Do they need regular partnering class?  Experience in genres other than ballet?  Lots of pointe work (not as much pointe work), an environment with competitive peers or a place that's more supportive, a chance to train in a specific style, a shorter sechedule or one that's jam packed ect. . .  . 

For my daughter our largest priority was that we would be someplace that was competitive enough that she would be placed with kids around her own age and still would be challenging because she trains with older kids at home.  She also wanted to go to a program that had a different feel than the camp like program she attended last year.  She auditioned lots of places that fit that criteria and made a chart based on what every intensive had to offer and chose WBS based on all those criteria and she's adoring everything about it (as far as I can tell, she generally just responds with one word texts).  She has a friend who auditioned lots of places and ended up attending the three letter program closest to home and is super frustrated that she seemed to be placed on age rather than skill and wishing she had performances and partnering and is wishing she went someplace different.

The very large programs that basically accept anyone with a basic level of skill (The Rock, ABT (they accept everyone but sort based on program), Joffery as the ones that come to mind) are generally really good programs educationally.  They hire solid teachers and have solid programs.  However because they accept such a wide variety of skill levels the age ranges in the programs are likely to be a wide spread (ten year olds and sixteen year olds in the same level).  There are also some competitive big name programs (Cough cough SAB) that treat their program more of an audition for their year round program rather than an educational experience so kids can grow and transform.
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ballerinamom13

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Reply with quote  #29 
"There are also some competitive big name programs (Cough cough SAB) that treat their program more of an audition for their year round program rather than an educational experience so kids can grow and transform."

And most people in the ballet world know this. Is that a problem?  Maybe that's what the small amount of people who get accepted want?  We don't have personal knowledge of the reasons people pick SI's.  What works for some won't work for others.  Maybe it's because it's an amazing Balanchine program and extremely hard to get into? Maybe it's the challenge to see if you are accepted, instead of going to smaller, less known places (even if they have decent training).  Maybe not auditioning for the selective SI's scares people because they really don't want to know where they stand?  There are hundreds of reasons. None of us know what's right for someone else, nor should we assume we do.
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heidi459

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Reply with quote  #30 
I think (although I don't want to speak for Meatball) the point is simply to try not to get blinded by the fancy names. Don't assume the big name is going to be your ticket to success and don't assume that those lesser name programs are only for lesser (less talented, less dedicated and determined, less serious) dancers. While many, probably most dancers have nothing but a positive experience w/the big name programs, I've known plenty who have gone only to be disappointed.  And similarly, while many have been disappointed by a lesser known program, I've known plenty who went thinking it would likely just be a way to stay in shape only to be surprised at the quality/intensity of the training.  Just a fact that can't be reinforced enough imo.  The obsession with 'the formula' can cause more stress than it's worth.   And I always feel badly for those who get sucked into it.
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meatball77

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Reply with quote  #31 
My point exactly. 
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ggsmith

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Reply with quote  #32 
I think that for parents without a dance background (like myself) it is hard to know where our dancer fits in the scheme of things.

A (rather obnoxious) acquaintance shared on social media that her daughter was placed in the top level at the ABT summer intensive.  Honestly, I don't know if she is delusional or uninformed.  Her 12-year-old is at the ABT Young Dancer Workshop, at its third (and newest) location, Tampa.

I think knowing that the program your dancer has been accepted to is very competition or has a place for everyone is helpful if you are trying to get an idea if professional dance instructors see potential in your dancer.

But while it might be terrific to be able to say you were accepted to Harvard Law School, another lesser known school could be a better place for the student for any of a variety of reasons.
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tendumom

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Reply with quote  #33 
If I am not mistaken, 12 it's the oldest you can be at the ABT Young Dancer Workshop (not really an intensive, some complain about the lack of intensity). I would suspect that every other 12 year old is also in the highest level. At 12, they are old enough to be accepted to the actual intensive program where a 12 year old would not be in the highest level. (Just for anyone not familiar.)
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dave9988

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Reply with quote  #34 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggsmith
I think that for parents without a dance background (like myself) it is hard to know where our dancer fits in the scheme of things.

A (rather obnoxious) acquaintance shared on social media that her daughter was placed in the top level at the ABT summer intensive.  Honestly, I don't know if she is delusional or uninformed.  Her 12-year-old is at the ABT Young Dancer Workshop, at its third (and newest) location, Tampa.


My favorites are the parents who post "My kid was accepted into the PRESTIGIOUS xxx program."  If they have to state they are "prestigious," that's your first clue they might not be. 

As others have pointed out, prestige doesn't mean anything relative to the actual educational experience.  But geez.  Some FB posts just reek of ego.
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