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DancemomCA

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Reply with quote  #1 
Just curious how everyone feels about a tour’s advertised faculty not being a part of your actual regional event? We traveled to attend Radix this weekend, and not only is the hip-hop teacher not someone even on the faculty, but Musical theater has been entirely eliminated, and that’s one of the best offerings ! So annoyed to make the trip and have it come up short. Has anyone ever contacted SO to express concern ? Thanks
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dave9988

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Reply with quote  #2 

There's a BTF convention that comes to town, one of the "headliners" hasn't been here in years.  That's OK, the teacher who has been coming is wonderful.

But cutting/changing the genres is tough.  I hate when we sign up, then go to a schedule packed with hip-hop and tap.  Our school teaches neither.  Some exposure to these is great, don't get me wrong.  But a full weekend of it? Not what we signed up for.

Complaining to SO won't do a thing, the SO has no control.  I'd go to the convention with any complaints.

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dave9988

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Reply with quote  #3 
If there is a benefit to speaking with SO, it would be limited to future "convention selection."  If it's a regular thing with one specific convention, perhaps SO will choose to go elsewhere in the future.
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Billpayer2000

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Reply with quote  #4 
The switch is likely covered in the "fine print."  Why must dance sometimes feel so shady? 
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breaktf

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Reply with quote  #5 
Hi guys! My name is Gil Stroming, the owner of BTF. I just wanted to comment regarding the faculty in certain cities. Please know... it is never our intent to "bait and switch" faculty for any of our events. Sometimes we know far in advance if a faculty member won't be in a certain city, and other times a faculty member might get a big job with only a few days notice. We do our best to replace them with someone we feel is equally awesome. I understand if you have travelled a long distance for one specific teacher and what a bummer it is if they aren't there. I really do apologize and would certainly offer a refund if someone wouldn't want to attend because the teacher they were planning on didn't end up being on the schedule.

I always recommend to anyone... if you are coming to a convention for one or two specific teachers, please call our office and we will be 100% transparent of the chances of that teacher(s) being in that city.

Again, my apologies. If you have any other questions or need anything at anytime, you can always email me personally: gil@breakthefloor.com.

Thanks, and have a great weekend.
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dancermom128

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Reply with quote  #6 
I don't see this as bait and switch at all. Conventions never guarantee that specific faculty will be there. Because these are working dancers they often book jobs that prevent them from coming and sometimes these changes happen at the last minute. My DD has her favorites and it's always disappointing when this happens but certainly not the fault of any convention.
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dancermom128

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billpayer2000
The switch is likely covered in the "fine print."  Why must dance sometimes feel so shady? 


What part of it is shady?
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Billpayer2000

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Reply with quote  #8 
Where to begin...the shady parts of dance
-leveling down
-adding young dancers to bring the average age down
-questionable policies and procedures of comps/conventions/studios
-overly mature music, routines and costuming of young dancers
-preferential treatment of large studios 
-secrecy surrounding fees, charges, etc

I could go on, but it is off-topic to this thread
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dancermom128

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billpayer2000
Where to begin...the shady parts of dance
-leveling down
-adding young dancers to bring the average age down
-questionable policies and procedures of comps/conventions/studios
-overly mature music, routines and costuming of young dancers
-preferential treatment of large studios 
-secrecy surrounding fees, charges, etc

I could go on, but it is off-topic to this thread


Lol, I didn't mean in general, I meant in this situation. Faculty in any city is never a guarantee. I don't see how it could be interpreted as shady.
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Billpayer2000

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Reply with quote  #10 
I wouldn't put anything past any organization in dance, especially with the money involved.  It really is "buyer beware."
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jule425

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Reply with quote  #11 
We attended Radix this year, and had a last minute switch with the ballet teacher. Not sure who was supposed to be there, but he's great.  After the class, when my daughter was talking about how much she had liked him, I had to break the news that if we attend another city he's not the regular teacher. Last year at Radix, Ivan from Nuvo subbed in for hip hop. Recently, I had to write a 2 AM e-mail to the parents of my students when my 82 year old mom was placed in ICU after I hopped a plane to Texas.(Thankfully after 2 weeks in the hospital, she is in skilled nursing now. Losing my dad in December has taken a toll on her health.) As much as our kids enjoy the teachers, they are all working dancers and possibly have family emergencies also.

side note: Dorky dance mom story.....While attending Radix last year, I was in the hotel elevator with Ivan. I kept looking at him thinking I'd seen him before. Finally, I asked how would I know you. He played dumb, then it clicked. I told him he was at the wrong convention for me to recognize him. My daughter was so glad she was not there when mom was being dumb, and talking to people. haha

Edited to add: I know that our minis, juniors and teens all had a musical theatre class with Eddie both years we've attended Radix. (2017, 2018)
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2dornot2d

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Reply with quote  #12 
My DD loves Nick Lazzarini and Andrew Winghart but this year at Jump they weren't teaching. She was disappointed when I showed her the workshop schedule, but after years of conventions she understands they have other jobs. DD also loves Katy Spreadbury and she was still listed on the first schedule so DD was happy. I think final schedule changed to somebody else that I didn't recognize the name and not on the faculty. After the class, DD said the ballet class was so much fun and she loved the male ballet teacher. Eclectic Groove class with Wade was totally new and we didn't know what to expect. I stayed and watched, and he was one of those teachers who really want the kids to learn. I loved him as a parent of students and would like to have more of those teachers as we attend 6-7 conventions a year. I hope they bring that ballet sub with Katy next year so they have 2 ballet classes.
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rubydancemom

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Reply with quote  #13 
The faculty changes don't bother me unless the change means certain genres are completely eliminated. We went to a convention over the weekend where there were 2 hip hop classes and 2 jazz funk classes (by the same teachers both days, but no lyrical or tap (or ballet, but we didn't expect it at this one). They also changed the day 2 schedule pretty drastically for the morning, and failed to communicate it to everyone, so my DD was at the convention 2 hours earlier than she needed to be (7:30 vs 9:30 on a Sunday morning). She had fun, but overall I was not impressed, and I don't see us going back. It felt like half the competition overall awards went to the dancers they brought with them as assistants.
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2dornot2d

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rubydancemom
The faculty changes don't bother me unless the change means certain genres are completely eliminated. We went to a convention over the weekend where there were 2 hip hop classes and 2 jazz funk classes (by the same teachers both days, but no lyrical or tap (or ballet, but we didn't expect it at this one). They also changed the day 2 schedule pretty drastically for the morning, and failed to communicate it to everyone, so my DD was at the convention 2 hours earlier than she needed to be (7:30 vs 9:30 on a Sunday morning). She had fun, but overall I was not impressed, and I don't see us going back. It felt like half the competition overall awards went to the dancers they brought with them as assistants.


That's too bad. Normally the conventions we attend, the assistants are title winners from the previous year and they perform their solos at the closing show... Our studio has a couple of those and they never compete at the conventions they assist. Why pay when you can perform your solo for free with everyone watching at the awards?
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momcrew

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Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2dornot2d
My DD loves Nick Lazzarini and Andrew Winghart but this year at Jump they weren't teaching. She was disappointed when I showed her the workshop schedule, but after years of conventions she understands they have other jobs. DD also loves Katy Spreadbury and she was still listed on the first schedule so DD was happy. I think final schedule changed to somebody else that I didn't recognize the name and not on the faculty. After the class, DD said the ballet class was so much fun and she loved the male ballet teacher. Eclectic Groove class with Wade was totally new and we didn't know what to expect. I stayed and watched, and he was one of those teachers who really want the kids to learn. I loved him as a parent of students and would like to have more of those teachers as we attend 6-7 conventions a year. I hope they bring that ballet sub with Katy next year so they have 2 ballet classes.


Nick Lazzarini was on tour with Shaping Sound for much of the winter so I'm sure that was the reason for his absence. Travis Wall is normally on the faculty for Nuvo as well and I'm sure there was disappointment in his not being at many of the winter tour locations. 
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mom24

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Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jule425
As much as our kids enjoy the teachers, they are all working dancers and possibly have family emergencies also.


But that's very different than what I think people are complaining about.  If a headliner hasn't EVER been to this location, and is probably never going to be at this location, they shouldn't advertise them as a teacher.
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mom24

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Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by breaktf
Hi guys! My name is Gil Stroming, the owner of BTF. ...
I always recommend to anyone... if you are coming to a convention for one or two specific teachers, please call our office and we will be 100% transparent of the chances of that teacher(s) being in that city. 


Shouldn't need to call.  If that teacher is not planning to be in that city, they shouldn't be on the advertisement!  If teachers vary widely from location to location, then advertising should be location specific!  

We enjoyed the one BTF convention we did this year, but the schedule / faculty changing was not a welcome surprise.  I had assumed it was a one-time thing, but sounds like it is common.  [frown]  

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Contempmomma

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Reply with quote  #18 
Jump NY did not have a hip hop class listed on final schedule . How this genre not be represented , especially in NYC was quite surprising . One of our students was there on his hip hop scholarship and chose not to go. He was not willing to spend the high hotel feels on jazz funk class alternative
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breaktf

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Reply with quote  #19 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom24


Shouldn't need to call.  If that teacher is not planning to be in that city, they shouldn't be on the advertisement!  If teachers vary widely from location to location, then advertising should be location specific!  

We enjoyed the one BTF convention we did this year, but the schedule / faculty changing was not a welcome surprise.  I had assumed it was a one-time thing, but sounds like it is common.  [frown]  



Hi again! I really understand your frustration and TRUST ME, I wish the industry was different. But unfortunately, location-specific advertising would be the same. There is no way to guarantee a certain faculty member will be in a certain city. Even if "so and so" is contracted for "JUMP New Orleans," often times they will get a movie, or commercial or whatever that will pull them away last minute. It's easy to say "well if they have a contract with you, why are they breaking it?" It's just not realistic. No one in the industry is going to start suing faculty for breach of contract. Faculty wouldn't sign on for Conventions, if they didn't have the flexibility to cancel occasionally for large, high profile jobs. It's just the way it is. I hope, and believe, most people that come to Conventions realize the overall value and don't base their entire experience on one or two people. The most I feel I can do is offer a refund if someone is unhappy with the final faculty or schedule. We do state on our website that faculty is subject to change, but I understand that can still be disappointing for some, and again, I apologize.
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classydance

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Reply with quote  #20 
HATS off to BTF!  

Bringing honesty and fairness to the entire Dance Comp.

Thanks Gil!
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dancermom128

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Reply with quote  #21 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom24


Shouldn't need to call.  If that teacher is not planning to be in that city, they shouldn't be on the advertisement!  If teachers vary widely from location to location, then advertising should be location specific!  

We enjoyed the one BTF convention we did this year, but the schedule / faculty changing was not a welcome surprise.  I had assumed it was a one-time thing, but sounds like it is common.  [frown]  



But cities aren't advertised individually. The only thing that happens is the schedule is released maybe a week or 2 before and sometimes those faculty members scheduled to be there are changed. I can say I have sometimes looked back at past years to see who's been to a certain city. For instance, Mark Meismer never seems to be in Buffalo but always seems to come to Boston and Meadowlands It's helped a bit with managing expectations but still Mark could book something last minute (one year he did something with Glee). It's always disappointing but understandable nonetheless.

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PastrySugar

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Reply with quote  #22 
Quote:
Originally Posted by breaktf
Hi guys! My name is Gil Stroming, the owner of BTF. I just wanted to comment regarding the faculty in certain cities. Please know... it is never our intent to "bait and switch" faculty for any of our events. Sometimes we know far in advance if a faculty member won't be in a certain city, and other times a faculty member might get a big job with only a few days notice. We do our best to replace them with someone we feel is equally awesome. I understand if you have travelled a long distance for one specific teacher and what a bummer it is if they aren't there. I really do apologize and would certainly offer a refund if someone wouldn't want to attend because the teacher they were planning on didn't end up being on the schedule.

I always recommend to anyone... if you are coming to a convention for one or two specific teachers, please call our office and we will be 100% transparent of the chances of that teacher(s) being in that city.

Again, my apologies. If you have any other questions or need anything at anytime, you can always email me personally: gil@breakthefloor.com.

Thanks, and have a great weekend.
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PastrySugar

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Reply with quote  #23 
I am humbled and impressed you have weighed in on this Gil! Thank you for caring!
Sherry
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MajorBrad

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Reply with quote  #24 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billpayer2000
Where to begin...the shady parts of dance
-leveling down
-adding young dancers to bring the average age down
-questionable policies and procedures of comps/conventions/studios
-overly mature music, routines and costuming of young dancers
-preferential treatment of large studios 
-secrecy surrounding fees, charges, etc

I could go on, but it is off-topic to this thread


This is the best summation of What To Avoid in Dance that I've ever seen! I dearly hope our Madison, Wisconsin studio sees your post and cleans things up! Thank u
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Twinkletoesx2

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Reply with quote  #25 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jule425
We attended Radix this year, and had a last minute switch with the ballet teacher. Not sure who was supposed to be there, but he's great.  After the class, when my daughter was talking about how much she had liked him, I had to break the news that if we attend another city he's not the regular teacher. Last year at Radix, Ivan from Nuvo subbed in for hip hop. Recently, I had to write a 2 AM e-mail to the parents of my students when my 82 year old mom was placed in ICU after I hopped a plane to Texas.(Thankfully after 2 weeks in the hospital, she is in skilled nursing now. Losing my dad in December has taken a toll on her health.) As much as our kids enjoy the teachers, they are all working dancers and possibly have family emergencies also.

side note: Dorky dance mom story.....While attending Radix last year, I was in the hotel elevator with Ivan. I kept looking at him thinking I'd seen him before. Finally, I asked how would I know you. He played dumb, then it clicked. I told him he was at the wrong convention for me to recognize him. My daughter was so glad she was not there when mom was being dumb, and talking to people. haha

Edited to add: I know that our minis, juniors and teens all had a musical theatre class with Eddie both years we've attended Radix. (2017, 2018)


The first time we did Nuvo I ended up in the elevator with Ivan too. He struck up a conversation and was very sweet. My dd was jealous lol. It was just small talk but he could have just kept quiet on looked at his phone.
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